Mouse, joystick and game controller exploits

[Edward Edgemenace]

The reason the keyboard arrow keys work as the baseline for pivoting, is because of the very drastic change in behavior, when stunned.

I made a very clear distinction between "glitches" and "exploits" - I'm sad to see you managed to miss that distinction. Regardless, for #9, I would like to see a camera zoom widget somewhere, instead of only the mouse wheel. I share your doubts, that Disney will care enough to fix it. I also agree it should have a very low-priority.

For 5, 6 & 7, you are talking about something else, not the exploits I described. Try doing it much, much, much faster and you'll see that you can fire them simultaneously.

[Sven Niscadae]

Originally Posted by Edward Edgemenace

I made a very clear distinction between "glitches" and "exploits" - I'm sad to see you managed to miss that distinction.

I didn't miss that distinction at all, Edward. You said "Cheaters using right-mouse to turn", "cheating by using mouse" when stun/grave shackles occurs. So using the mouse look feature is fine and dandy until I get stunned? I better let not touch my right mouse button, I'll be cheating then.

The stun description above your health bar confirms it; you are not supposed to be able to move/turn that way, with the mouse.

Slow's description says "Slowed movement", yes, I know. I'm betting Disney defines "movement" as forward, backward, or sideways movement. The same thing is possibly applied to Grave Shackles (which is "unable to move") If you're going to include pivoting then we better take all actions out such as attacking because my arm moves too.

I mostly don't see how you can assume what Disney's intentions are for the game's design. I'm not saying we should all just accept odd things that happen in the game because we don't know exactly what D wants it to do. However, your view of a pivoting exploit, to me, is ridiculous as you'll see the same sort of behavior in any other game - MMO, FPS, or otherwise.

I'll turn this to another direction because I don't want to turn your thread into a battle over what Disney's master plan may be.

How about I suggest that there's a bug with the keyboard keys and pivoting when stunned or shackled? It seems to me that D just hindered/disabled the keyboard keys (up/down/left/right/WASDQE) for the duration of a stun or shackle because it was easier that way. I suggest that they fix that by allow the pivoting keys (A/D/left/right) to function normally.

For 5, 6 & 7, you are talking about something else, not the exploits I described. Try doing it much, much, much faster and you'll see that you can fire them simultaneously.

Really? I was mousing around as fast as I can. Is your computer skipping a beat allowing for these extra clicks and presses to be caught? For me the game runs smooth as silk and there's absolutely no way for me to change my cannon ammo type in mid-fire without it going through the reload process.

As for the grenades, I said I was able to duplicate what you are talking about (quickly throwing multiple grenade types without waiting for a reload). The pistol, on the other hand, I can except that it made me reload after 3 shots no matter how fast I did it.

[Edward Edgemenace]

Originally Posted by Sven Niscadae

I didn't miss that distinction at all, Edward. You said "Cheaters using right-mouse to turn", "cheating by using mouse" when stun/grave shackles occurs. So using the mouse look feature is fine and dandy until I get stunned? I better let not touch my right mouse button, I'll be cheating then.

By calling that "cheating" I was attempting to shift focus to when it occurs in PvP: one person using keyboard vs. one person mousing. That is, exploiting the behavior to the detriment of another pirate (who read the hint "You can use WASD to move.") I don't agree with your theory that they did it that way because it was easiest: the forward backward movement looks like a much different rate of slowing than the pivoting, yet mouse slow pivoting is unaffected.

So, you found my terminology of "cheating" to be ridiculous when you didn't pick up the logical extension to PvP. Fine. But you did see the dramatic inconsistency. Fine again. In the interests of thread harmony, I'll concede that perhaps they didn't intend for the dramatic pivoting slowness on keyboard. It still is an unfair advantage - unconscious perhaps - when used against another pirate.

Really? I was mousing around as fast as I can. Is your computer skipping a beat allowing for these extra clicks and presses to be caught? For me the game runs smooth as silk and there's absolutely no way for me to change my cannon ammo type in mid-fire without it going through the reload process.

Now, I didn't send you those specs for nothing. No, my computer is not skipping a beat or something. The first time I saw this was on cannon; the first time I did this was the day before yesterday on cannon. Pressing Ctrl THEN clicking fires more than one ammo type with some regularity. I'll experiment more with the timing to see if I can teach you how to reproduce this exploit. (Cheating...positively. The first time I saw it was when I was hit by one-of-each from a single cannon in SvS. It has been around for a while now.)

As for the grenades, I said I was able to duplicate what you are talking about (quickly throwing multiple grenade types without waiting for a reload). The pistol, on the other hand, I can except that it made me reload after 3 shots no matter how fast I did it.

Are you saying that one also works by pressing Ctrl 2 3 4 5 6 7 without the mouse, yet stops after only 3? Maybe I tested that one incompletely, but it sounds to me like you didn't reproduce what I was describing, instead a completely different bug. Three simultaneous shots simultaneously is still wrong...each shot is supposed to wait for the "firing" animation of the previous shot. But that wasn't the exploit I was describing, merely a lightweight cousin of it? I'll test this a bunch more tonight.

[Cheleszoo]

Originally Posted by Edward Edgemenace

By calling that "cheating" I was attempting to shift focus to when it occurs in PvP: one person using keyboard vs. one person mousing. That is, exploiting the behavior to the detriment of another pirate (who read the hint "You can use WASD to move.") I don't agree with your theory that they did it that way because it was easiest: the forward backward movement looks like a much different rate of slowing than the pivoting, yet mouse slow pivoting is unaffected.

I'm not so sure that there are too many ppl out there playing without a mouse. And we've argued before in many different threads about "fair" PVP. With all the worry about, No Dolls, No Tonics, Blades Only, Combos Only, No Dirt, No Brawl..... I don't think it ever occured to anyone to say - No Mouse. I don't think anyone even thinks twice about the mouse because it is so second nature to use it.

If shackles is the issue, then that's where to lay the blame, not the mouse. The person being shackled "should" be disabled in both the keyboard and mouse if it is true to the description. But that is not the case and I for one am going to Asp the Doller to shatter the attunement whether I'm shackled or not. There is nothing to stop the "doller" from being out of range or moving constantly to make a harder target. And in PVP you are going to try to win by any means you have within the rules that were set (and any PVP with set rules will not allow the use of Dolls so shackles would not be an issue). Free for all, well that's just it, a Free for all.

The mouse is for precise aiming - not the keyboard. The players online handbook details it's use and the tutorial on how to use the gun specifically demonstrates the mouse and how to aim with the right mouse button. It's one of the first skills we are taught in the game (aiming the cannon and firing at the ship). It is Ying and Yang with the keyboard. If people are not using the suggested Mouse and only using the keyboard, well i can only say they are jipping themselves out of a more satisfying way to play the game.

[Poison elf]

My view is it is not cheating to use a sensible method that works best. In most games, that is designed around your mouse, versus keyboard options. In pvp environments, many of these things are key to help survive against another opponent. Setting a mouse to scan the screen quicker, to faster internet connection. In my view, this is following the same path to internet connection and its cheating if someone has a faster connection?

I think if there is argument in this area in game mechanics, it should be approached that way. Why can cutlass jumpers still jump when stun. Why does cutlass seem to have the effect more over dagger, grenades, pistol etc. Why is pistol undead shot useless in pvp, type things.

Those that use keyboard options only, should report that they are not getting the same response as other users. In that point you are correct that they should report it.

This being said, I don't think we need more going backwards in this game, they need to try to go forward for the FIRST TIME. I have seen way to many reductions, degrades and such and not any upgrading at all. Specially these areas like upgraded weapons, that give higher % damage to lower level skills to level slower.



I am not seeing the multiple shot either with mousing different ammos, have heard of some using multiple shots like this though and may be a real glitch in there somewhere. I have noticed before though, switching ammo does cut the wait out some in something like throwing next grenade.