Punishment Game Abusers (Suggestion)

[MacIronhawk]

Originally Posted by akamystic

However, just keep in mind if you are cheating to make the leader board, beat another player in SVS or PVP....that's unacceptable. .

Obviously there are people in the game who haven't bothered to report these bugs.
Players shouldn't be punished for something the developers won't fix.

It would also take a while to make something to detect players who use bugs. And guess what? That means more time working on things that won't be new content.

I'd rather have the developers work on new content than waste time trying to punish players for little exploits they haven't bothered to fix. It also means losing players which means losing money. I don't think Disney will do that.

[Edward Edgemenace]

Are more people leaving because of lack of content, or pervasive exploits? Perhaps I am in the minority. But ignoring both, costs them revenue.

That said, to have their moderators implement a system of holding players accountable for their actions, is a low-cost fix that they can do. Having their programmers (limited resources) add content, is quite a separate thing.

By training their moderators to expel people from the game, when caught cheating, very few people will go out of their way to glitch (as so very many now, do.)

[League]

Glitching often makes for a heck of a screenshot, and a heck of good time. Quite frankly, some of the most fun stuff to do in the game is stuff that I'm pretttttty sure wasn't intended to even be there.

For instance, Swash II just shook my mind when he walked up by himself, ascending into the heavens: nothing wrong there. I had a good time hanging with my pal Balto having glitched into the shipwright's ship. For the most part, glitches are harmless. (Granted, those should be fixed, but sometimes the new updates have fun unexpected things coming with them.)

[Edward Edgemenace]

Originally Posted by League

Glitching often makes for a heck of a screenshot, and a heck of good time. Quite frankly, some of the most fun stuff to do in the game is stuff that I'm pretttttty sure wasn't intended to even be there.

For instance, Swash II just shook my mind when he walked up by himself, ascending into the heavens: nothing wrong there. I had a good time hanging with my pal Balto having glitched into the shipwright's ship. For the most part, glitches are harmless. (Granted, those should be fixed, but sometimes the new updates have fun unexpected things coming with them.)

I don't think anyone is suggesting that a moderator would penalize harmless glitches. This discussion is about penalizing people who abuse exploits.

[League]

Seems to be just as harmless I think; ranking among other players is the only place where I think it is a legitimately-called problem (as in, having an edge in combat against them). Those shouldn't even be seeing the light of day, but, in an effort to rush to please, they do.

Every sort of exploitable thing should be documented on Test, if not by a player, then at least by a designer. They should be looking into the history of past glitches, seeing what causes them, and then avoiding the same means by which they came. I don't thing other games come along with a horde of new glitches every time they update, but I may be wrong.

[MacIronhawk]

Originally Posted by Edward Edgemenace

I don't think anyone is suggesting that a moderator would penalize harmless glitches. This discussion is about penalizing people who abuse exploits.

Harmless or not it's a waste of the developers time.
Making something that can detect players using glitches is harder than most of use may think. How would they create a system that kNOWS when a player is doing a glitch they shouldn't be doing?

My main concern is, why do some people care if others glitch to cheat? All you have to do is report these glitches and Disney will fix them.

Besides, I don't think disney will ban some of their paying customers for using a glitch they haven't fixed yet.

[Edward Edgemenace]

Again, this entire thread, as I see it, has nothing to do with developer's time. It has to do with moderators' time. Monitoring players actions is already something they do; they should instead take more direct action when they see someone using an exploit. Maybe that is as simple as training the moderators better.

Furthermore, your assertion that reported glitches get fixed overnight is ridiculous. Instant desolation, anyone? Invulnerability, anyone? Invisibility, anyone? Skeleton/infinite ammo, anyone? C'mon, these are the oldest glitches in the game.

Lastly, they do ban paying customers every day, for chat system abuses. Why then, should more severe exploits be condoned?

[Ghostcannon]

Originally Posted by Edward Edgemenace

Again, this entire thread, as I see it, has nothing to do with developer's time. It has to do with moderators' time. Monitoring players actions is already something they do; they should instead take more direct action when they see someone using an exploit. Maybe that is as simple as training the moderators better.

Furthermore, your assertion that reported glitches get fixed overnight is ridiculous. Instant desolation, anyone? Invulnerability, anyone? Invisibility, anyone? Skeleton/infinite ammo, anyone? C'mon, these are the oldest glitches in the game.

Lastly, they do ban paying customers every day, for chat system abuses. Why then, should more severe exploits be condoned?

That's what I really ment. The punishment rule will only apply to those who abuse the game for his/her own befinit in improving his/her pirate stats. Harmless glitches like the flying glitch and those types whoever is doing these should not be punished, but if reported he/she should get a reward (per say, 500 gold coins).

Edward and you are right on the last line as well... Paying customers get banned everyday for abusing the chat system...losing Money for Big D is not an issue. The same rule of abusing the chat system is the same rule "[1st Offense]" for those who abuse the game-play.

All I mean is that if there is a set of punishment rule for chat abuse, there should also be a punishment rule for game-play abuse. That will make the whole game better, more challenging, and fair for everyone.

[MacIronhawk]

Originally Posted by Edward Edgemenace

Again, this entire thread, as I see it, has nothing to do with developer's time. It has to do with moderators' time. Monitoring players actions is already something they do; they should instead take more direct action when they see someone using an exploit. Maybe that is as simple as training the moderators better.

Furthermore, your assertion that reported glitches get fixed overnight is ridiculous. Instant desolation, anyone? Invulnerability, anyone? Invisibility, anyone? Skeleton/infinite ammo, anyone? C'mon, these are the oldest glitches in the game.

Lastly, they do ban paying customers every day, for chat system abuses. Why then, should more severe exploits be condoned?

Sorry but I've never seen a moderator in the game before. The moderators I haven't seen deal with helping the players.(live chat, customer support, etc...)

I still don't see why players should be banned for exploits that can be fixed.(you also have to realize how many players won't know they'll get banned for these exploits.)

[Sven Niscadae]

Originally Posted by Edward Edgemenace

Lastly, they do ban paying customers every day, for chat system abuses. Why then, should more severe exploits be condoned?

They also suspend paying customers every day for not abusing the chat system, even for saying innocent things to people they know in real life. They usually don't consider the full context of what was said, only that "OMG personal information! Bad Bad!" equals a vacation.

Originally Posted by MacIronHawk

I still don't see why players should be banned for exploits that can be fixed.(you also have to realize how many players won't know they'll get banned for these exploits.)

Which is why a warning should be issued first. Most of the time, Disney does their 3 day suspensions on Fridays, probably to avoid phone calls since they're out for the weekend and the suspension will be up on Monday anyway when they do get a phone call. By outright suspending people for something that they may not be aware was wrong, they risk losing the account when the customer gets upset and cancels their subscription. Of course they risk that with chat suspensions as well.

Punish people who exploit that results in cheating, especially when it harms others' gameplay and enjoyment; though I'm sure it may be difficult to prove they were cheating in the first place. These bugs are unintended so they probably aren't logging when the unexpected happens. If they knew what triggered it, they would just fix it in the first place.

[DryWater]

Originally Posted by MacIronhawk

I still don't see why players should be banned for exploits that can be fixed.(you also have to realize how many players won't know they'll get banned for these exploits.)

If people didn't look for/use exploits, this would be a non issue. (Don't need a discourse reply on; but they will and do, or, it's human nature to do it)

I have heard many excuses from players as to why they svs glitch, the worst being: well, everybody else does... if you/me/we don't, then there is no way you can win. Just another example of someone trying to justify their actions to themself with no responsibility.

I feel bad for the kids who try to svs with 18 - 50 y/o adolescents who feel the need to waggle their...

If people can't/don't enjoy the game as it was intended to be played, maybe they should find another game to play.

I agree with ya Ghostcannon, 100%. I personally think Disney should be ban happy.

[akamystic]

Originally Posted by Edward Edgemenace

Lastly, they do ban paying customers every day, for chat system abuses. Why then, should more severe exploits be condoned?

I do believe they are more concerned about sharing of personal information that could lead to potential legal battle. All it takes is a minor to provide email (or other personal info) to an adult and the rest could get extremely ugly (very costly for Disney). Glitching into a wall or trying to level a weapon glitched is minor compared to someone causing harm to another due to sharing of personal info.

I have heard of several folks getting banned due to content of conversations with others. Most of the time they were attempting to exchange email addresses or other info. A friend of mine in the game was sent the chat transcript from Disney when he questioned why he was banned for 24 hours. He was trying to provide his email address to another player in the game.

So you have the players point of view and Disney's point of view....vastly different I can assure you. Ultimately, we would hope a majority of their focus is on improving the game. What we feel is crucial might be a grain of salt to Disney.

[Dr. Zeppers]

Fix the glitchs, dont punish those playing with them.
However, I do believe disciplinary actions should be taken on those exploiting them against others such in SVS/PVP, or if its effecting leaderboards perhaps.

One of the issues I do not think some realize when comparing actions taken on chat, to actions taken on utilizing glitchs is that chat logs are recorded. With chat, since this is all logged, there is proof of indescretion, to act upon. Glitchs, by their nature are not expected by development, and thereby somewhat impossible to track. Unless the glitching player submits his/her local game log files (not very likely), they are not going to have any viable proof that its actually a glitch being exploited.

Lets face it if they could detect when someone used a "glitch" then it would be pretty easy to resolve all glitchs. Images/screenshots can be altered, so externally represented 'proof' is still not worthy enough for them to 'act' upon.

[Poison elf]

Originally Posted by Ghostcannon

I would suggest that big D would set a rule of ponishment for those who abuse the game only for the benefit of gaining REPs, LvL ups weapons, Gold, PvP, and SvS.

The following will be the new punishment for all users breaking the rule

[1st Offense]
3 days ban with all account information reset to previously updated data.

[2nd Offense]
7days ban with all account information reset
(Delete all Gold in account / All weapons lvl in the account reset to lvl 1 / All characters in the account reset to lvl 1 /all stat points set to 1 /ships reset to default (light sloop) )

[3rd Offense]
Permanent Ban.

This will put an end for all the glitches where a pirate benefit him/herself of obtaining any of the aforementioned categories. Unbenifited glitches are excluded from the rule, but must be reported to the big D for fixes (e.g. flying glitch) where a reward (in gold) should be given to thoes mateys who find and 1st report these type of unharm glitches. This will make the game better and fair for everyone. Enough is enough with the pvp and invisibility glitching already, the whole Tortuga on Abassa is full of red lvl Cap pirates.

What do you think about this suggestion, Matey?

I see this only a possibility for a worse problem than they have ever had before. Some of these last posts were talking about what has happen with chat, and ban's. Implementing something like this would be ten fold in problems. Chat in itself has had a huge discrepancy in what you can and can not say. People have left over issues over chat ban's and no set rules other than what someone feels at the moment to ban players. Guild site OK, Not OK, Not OK with Vent info etc.

Now lets put this in place, how many of you used hex shot before the change to level on gypsies, molusk etc. Well apparently you all should be ban, it wasn't suppose to be that way. Can you imagine the problems to a decreasing membership game things like this would cause.

As for #2 offense, hate to say it, but that would be a plus many would try to get. At least to the point of previous characters not done, being able to get the first level weapons again to level better.

The fact is , there are people like me on test, that will actually do just that = test. Wall glitches, Invulnerability, or how much rep can be gained off one kill etc. If they are not fixed, they go to live, plus others are always being found. To punish players for their own incompetence is a ridiculous idea. Hopefully from the huge screw up with chat that lessons was somewhat learned.

I for one am all for equal play for all, and use of exploits against other players a injustice to their play. Such things as leaving quick cast desolation, or skipped combos in the game since tavern take over is not players fault. When a player has things like skipped combos when there was freedom to choose how to build a character, they are to be ban if they swing there dagger or cutlass ever? Disney made a choice to make this injustice, and had notice before its release, but chose to do so. So when they are making choices to do these things to players, I find it hard to fathom the thought at all to penalize players for it.

Don't get me wrong though, I think the invisible king's glitch and disengaging enemies, is a big problem that should be dealt with. As well as several other issues effecting everyone's play. The trouble is they are not be dealt with and definitely not in a timely manner when they are. Similar to giving mastered pirates something to do.

[Edward Edgemenace]

I see a lot of valid points made, but there are a couple I'd like to address:

* People try to find glitches because there is no penalty for being caught.

I see this proposal as DIRECTLY countering that mistake. By having absolutely no penalty for glitching, Disney is encouraging it implicitly.

* Screen shots can be modified, but chat logs can be modified more easily. They are no more or less valid in any way.

* Accidental glitches might be encountered; it would be the moderator's discretion to see if this person had been reported before/recently/frequently, etc. If not, they could choose to just log the person off and send an e-mail warning.

It you got booted when caught, there would be an incentive to NOT cheat. There would be an incentive to not search for exploits. As it stand now, exploits are condoned.